Help New to Maintenance

[Dee 25]

Hi i'm dee, ive finished my TFR lipotrim last wednesday at 11st 3lbs after four weeks of lipotrim and loosing 20lbs.

My normal lipotrim weigher was on holiday so havent had much guidance of what i should be eating.

i've been having a small salad and chicken/tuna/ham at evening and 2 maintenance sachets.
But was still hungry so introduced a apple and if peckish whole tomatoes and pickled onions.

Feeling really bloated, been having loads of water but had diet coke and dilute so that might not help.

i still need to loose 10lbs

did have a pack of chewits has needed sugar but feel guilty now, any suggestions

please help
Dee xx

 

[Scotsmist]

Hi Dee

Your pharmacy should have given you the refeed sheet..you really need to follow this 100% to avoid unnecessary gain as your glycogen levels will be filling....you could be bloated because of the type of foods you have been eating straight away.

Mini posted a sticky in the refeed section of the actual refeed program.....I have copy and pasted this for you.

I know you have been doing your own type of refeed for the past few days but if you have a look at this it may point you in the right direction......

have a look also at other refeed/maintenance diaries and that will give you an idea.

Well done on your loss so far.

Keep posting and jumping on here and there is usually someone here to advise.

Here is what Mini posted.

LIPOTRIM PHARMACY PROGRAMME.

Refeeding after Lipotrim Total Food Replacement without Excessive Weight Regain.

Preventing unnecessary weight gain after dieting...

Remember, under non-dieting the primary source of fuel that the body uses for energy is its blood sugar. When the blood sugar supply gets low the body has reserves of sugar which are stored as a complex molecule called glycogen. Glycogen is stored in the body bound to a great deal of water. When we change the amount of glycogen in the body we also change the amount of water. Glycogen and water are heavy. Changes will affect our weight a great deal and in a very short timespan. After dieting the body will again need glycogen and it will be restored with the reintroduction of food. A few simple facts about glycogen will help you to understand how to prevent a great deal of unnecessary weight regain after total food replacement.

1. Glycogen is made of sugar and that is, therefore, a carbohydrate. A pound of glycogen is worth about 1800 Calories. 1800 Calories deficit in the daily intake can use up a pound of glycogen from storage

2. Glycogen is stored with about 4 parts of water for each part of glycogen. This means that a pound of glycogen may hold an additional 4 pounds of water. 1800 Calories of Calorie deficit in the food eaten can cause a 5 pound weight loss. Compare that with the real need for fat loss. The same 1800 Calorie deficit will only use up 1/2 pound of fat.

3.Glycogen is stored in the liver, muscles and fat cells of the body. The amount we can store can vary depending upon what we eat and how much we use our muscles. Recent research suggests that some people may store as much as a kilogram of glycogen that can be mobilised in the first few days using a vlcd diet. This could mean that such a person could lose almost a stone in weight during the first few days of dieting and not yet have burned any fat.

4. Glycogen is used up and replaced as a matter of course all the time. Think of the glycogen stores the way you think of a kitchen jug that contains sugar. When the levels get low it is easy to fill it up. Daily activities of living and sleeping use glycogen up. Eating fills glycogen stores back up, every day.

5. It is possible to overfill the glycogen stores so that they contain more than the normal levels. Athletes do this and call it carbohydrate loading. Athletes stop eating carbohydrate to deplete their glycogen stores and then feast on carbohydrates. This gives them a larger reserve tank of ready fuel for endurance exercises, such as marathon running. If we eat a lot of carbohydrate foods right after dieting we will accomplish the same thing - extra glycogen that we will not burn up in a few hours of exercise; a lot of extra water that will stay as long as the glycogen (until the next diet or marathon type exercise); extra weight on the scales that cannot be distinguished from fat, makes you depressed and inclined to eat in despair. Totally unnecessary.

6. If carbohydrate foods are reintroduced gradually and in the right sequence over a period of days, the glycogen will return to a normal and modest level without unnecessary weight gain.

Carbohydrate foods include: vegetables, potato, cereal, breads, pasta/rice and fruits. There are carbohydrate foods containing a lot of simple sugars - such as fruit - and those we term 'complex', such as most vegetables.

These will form the bulk (60%) of your long term change to healthy eating buy need to be controlled during refeeding and afterwards for those who have had an insulin resistance problem.




The plan for Refeeding applies to both men and women...
Refeeding


Keep these points in mind:

First day after Total Food Replacement is high protein.

Second day is high protein, modest complex carbohydrate - low fat.

Third day is high protein, modest compels carbohydrate with some cereals - low fat.

Fourth day is high protein, high complex carbohydrate, modest cereals, fruit and other simple sugars - low fat.

The rest of your life is low fat and weight under control.

Lipotrin Refeeding:

The first step in weight management is bridging the gap between Total Food Replacement (TFR) and, so called, "real food". Directly following TFR we are going to guide you through a slow and gradual refeeding process. There are two reasons for the refeeding strategy:

1. You have lost a considerable amount of body fat during your Lipotrim regime, but you have also depleted your glycogen stores, along with their attending water. If you jump directly from TFR into a high carbohydrate meal, your glycogen and water stores will fill up excessively, causing an immediate weight gain that may be as much as 7-10 pounds. This is not a fat gain - it is a fluid gain - but is demoralizing, nonetheless. That is why the transition plan introduces carbohydrate in a controlled way, so that such a weight retain should not occur.

2. During your TFR regime, you ate nothing in addition to your Lipotrim servings very day and drank enough water to float a small tanker. During this time, your palate, used to a steady diet of salty, fatty, oily and sugary foods, has had an enforced rest.

Something very interesting has happened during the rest: your tastebuds, reprieved from a fat/salt/sugar entrapment, have undergone a purification. This palate retraining is one of the most profound results of your TFR regime. Do not throw this perception away by eating your way into the same old problem foods again, just because you used to like them. Changes have to be made to your previous eating behaviour and now is the time to take positive action.

The plan (applies to both men and women).....

Follow exactly - do not add extras and, more importantly, do not miss out any steps. You may have milk in your tea and coffee, if required, and you can now have diet drinks again. Avoid fruit juices (simple sugars) until the end of the week. No alcohol. Try to drink plenty of water. Most people do not drink adequate water and now you are in the habit, stick with it. At least 2 litres per day.

DAY 1.

Have 2 Lipotrim servings and one meal, as follows (men continue to have 2 servings, as before, while women take 1 less serving of Lipotrim).

at lunchtime or evening meal time you may have some skinless, boneless chicken breast or white fish fillet, or some skinless turkey (about 4-6ozs.) The fish or chicken may be steamed, microwaved, baked or cooked with a little water in a non-stick pan. Season with salt and pepper. Or you may have tuna fish in water or brine (drained). Vegetarians may use tofu or quorn.

You may also have either a moderate serving of salad (small breakfast bowl) from any of the following: lettuce, cucumber cress and watercress, tomatoes, mushrooms, onions, peppers, bean sprouts, celery dressed with a little lemon juice or wine vinegar (try balsamic vinegar, it is quite special), or if you prefer, a moderate serving ( 2 heaped table spoons - no more)of some cooked vegetables. You may have bread, grains (rice) or pasta until Day 4. Fruit should wait until Day 4 at the earliest (later if you have carbohydrate problems). You can have milk in tea/coffee.

DAY 2

You will have only 1 Lipotrim serving and 2 meals, as described for Day 1.

Day 3

Same as Day 2, but you may also have - at one meal only - an 8 ounce potato, plain boiled, mashed or baked, but with no addition of any fat. You may like to top with some skimmed milk, plain yogurt or very low fat fromage frais and a sprinkle of herbs.

Day 4-7

A Lipotrim serving for your breakfast plus.....

up to 3 serving of fruit (if you suffer from the insulin resistance problem, then eat these late in the day and do not snack on them during the day)

up to 2 slices of bread or 1 pita or 1 roll or 1 bagel (without fatty spread)

Any vegetables you want except avocado, 1 or 2 servings with your meals (2 tablespoons per serving)

any of the skimmed milk products.

fish fillet (any size) or 6 ounces of chicken or turkey, as described before, or one tin of tuna in water or brine, drained. Vegetarians may use tofu, textured vegetable protein (TVP) or quorn.

Lean meat with all visible fat trimmed off

low fat recipes prepared with low fat sauces - eg lean mince with tomatoes Bolognese sauce

medium baking potato or 6 small new potatoes or one serving of instant mashed potatoes (the kind with no added fat- read the label).
Instead of potato, you may have 4ozs of rice or pasta (cooked weight).

This schedule may be continued for several weeks - especially if you have lost a lot of weight - 5/6 stones or more - as you will need time to adjust to a different eating behaviour and quantities. Check your weight every week at the pharmacy; if it is going up, then action must be taken to address the types and quantities of food eaten. The maintenance food products are advised during this time to add extra control whilst adjusting to your new eating behaviour.

Sample menu for days 4 to 7.....

Breakfast Lipotrim serving.

Lunch Fish fillet (any type - cod, salmon etc), serving of potatoes ( 1 medium jacket or 6 new potatoes or a serving-spoon mash - no added fat) Yogurt ( low fat).

Diner 4-6 ozs chicken (no skin), jacket potato, salad. Fruit (if appropriate) or low fat dessert.

Evening Sandwich (no spread of any sort), consisting of: pickles, fat-free mayonnaise, salad/carrot, slice cold meat (low fat).

Snack 1 or 2 pieces of fruit (evening, if appropriate)


Breakfast Lipotrim serving

Lunch Sandwich (no spread) - any low fat filling, eg tuna. Bowl of salad. 2 pieces of fruit (if appropriate) or yoghurt.

Dinner Spaghetti Bolognese, consisting of: drained lean mince, low fat sauce, 4 ozs. Cooked spaghetti, serving spoon of vegetables. Dessert.

Snack or Evening.

Tub of very low fat fromage fraise, flavoured to suit with either slices of fruit or low fat jelly crystals for a sweet option or herbs and spices with added crunchy vegetable, for a savoury snack.

Or maintenance range - orange-crème drink or chocolate whip dessert (see leaflet).

The main point to understand in following the plan is not to have an any added fat in your food or in its preparation.

There is more than adequate fat for daily requirements naturally occurring in a diet chosen from a wide range of foods. There is no benefit to adding fat in preparation - only weight back on.

MAINTENANCE AFTER REFEEDING.

The failure of all diets has, in the past been maintenance. Regardless of the methods of weight loss, more than 95 people out of every 100 who managed to lose some weight have put it all back by the end of one year.

By five years, it was hard to find anyone who had kept their weight off.

The failure of weight maintenance is largely due to the over reliance on 3 rather ineffectual means of weight control.

These are:

(1.) exercise, (2) portion control and (3) Calorie counting.

By now you should all understand the limitations of each of these strategies.

Exercise cannot cope with a large enough excess of Calories.
Portion control and overall food restriction trigger primitive hunger instincts and lead to out of control eating.
Therefore, weight maintenance fails.

One of the reasons that people find weight maintenance so difficult is that, in serious overweight, more than one problem may exist at the same time.

Most people now appreciate the fact that, in order to resist weight regain, it is important to avoid as much unnecessary fat in the diet as possible.

This simple message remains true, despite the sometimes confusing messages about fat that are presented in the media.

Remember the simple statement - Fat Makes You Fat..

Some of the confusion is caused by the commercial needs of the edible fats industry. This is a very large wealthy industry which loses income when people avoid eating its products.

Other causes of confusion relate to the differences between saturated and unsaturated fats.

There may well be health implications associated with the balance between saturated and unsaturated fats in our food intake. BUT, the effect on our Weight is exactly the same whether we eat animal fat, fish fat, olive fat. Vegetable fat or any other fat - saturated, mono-unsaturated or poly unsaturated. FAT makes you FAT.





*Information for you on 'Meal Replacement Schedule'...

After refeeding, begin by replacing any 7 meals per week with standard Lipotrim formula or flapjack. 1.) This permits you to remain in control of your total weekly caloric intake.

2.) After 14 days, you need to return to the pharmacy to be weighed:

* if your weight has remained stable, continue in this manner;

* if your weight continues to drop, reduce the meal replacements to 6 for the next 2 weeks - repeat the sequence, substituting one traditional meal for a meal replacement until your weight remains stable;

* if your weight increases, then you must replace further meals. Replace 9 meals with formula for 2 weeks. If still not stable, substitute for 11 meals.

Find your appropriate level of meal replacements for weight stability. Then make sure that you attend the pharmacy once a month for a check. Always adjust your meal replacement schedule to the previous month's weight stability.

Source: Lipotrim

 

[JanD]

Hi Dee!

What a shame you didn't have the refeed plan to start with

If I were you I'd disregard what you've done since last week as well as whatever the scales tell you and start the refeed plan proper. It may be a bit backwards but probably better than muddling through not quite knowing what to do. Just a suggestion.

Well done on what you've achieved so far and don't let any slight blip as a result of this get you down or put you off. It IS only a blip - if it's there at all! xx

 

[Dee 25]

Thanks Jan

yeah silly ******* didnt give me the refeed sheet has my normal weigher had been on hol for 2 weeks.

I got weighed on monday and put 2lbs on, so she advised me to start on the refeed program from day4 with the meals and to have between 1000 and 1500. so ive been weighing everything and writing down every calorie has i only have 6 weeks today for my holiday to turkey and want tobe 10st 7lbs.

i had 1300 last night, but going to try to have 1200 every day. and i use either a maintenance shake or caramel bar in the day.

here is my menu for today
b: grapefruit and 50g gluten free porridge
l: maintenance bar or shake salad, ham and egg
d:salad, very small jacket potatoe with tuna mayo
low fat yogurt if any cals left

how does this sound.
really need to be loosing.

any suggestions on meals would be good
i usually have extra low fat mayo, beetroot and pickled onions with my salad

deexx

 

[JanD]

Hiya ..

Don't understand why you're having the Lipotrim serving AND a meal at the same time? Usually you'd have the shake/bar for breakie then 2 meals with a couple of fruit snacks if necessary.
I thought having them before a meal was for maintenance - not if you wanted to carry on losing - but I might be wrong.

If it helps I'll post the link to my refeed diary - it's a good while ago now so I don't remember all the details. I'll go and find that now x

 

[JanD]

Here 'tis x

(JanD on the refeeding bus.)(JanD on the refeeding bus.)(JanD on the refeeding bus.)(JanD on the refeeding bus.)(JanD on the refeeding bus.)http://www.minimins.com/lipotrim-ref...eding-bus.html (JanD on the refeeding bus.)

 

[Dee 25]

thanks for that jan your diary was good to look at.

well im coeliac so i cant have bread, pasta and didnt want to have too much potatoes and my lipotrim lady said to have at least 1200 kcals so thought this would be ok.

she said thats why i put on this week cos i didnt folllow refeed and not having enough kcals.

i wouldnt be having them at same time.
but dont want to have loads of kcals left over.

dee x

 

[JanD]

Well the refeed info doesn't mention calories - as long as you're having 3 decent meals and a couple of fruit snacks if you need them I wouldn't be upping my calories to reach a magic number personally.
However it's well known that advice given by Lipotrim 'people' varies enourmously - even within the head office, depending on who you happen to speak to.
This is one of my 'things' about calorie counting & why I won't do it - I would be eating something, whether I needed/wanted it or not JUST to reach that magic number.
When all said and done refeed is about replenishing glycogen stores gradually and getting slowly used to eating again. Your gain will have been purely because of not being able to do that (through no fault of your own) and therefore showing a fluid gain which is what happens when glycogen is restored too quickly. There's no way it was fat.

Obviously it's ultimately up to you what you do but I think we are our own best advisers IF we listen to our bodies. You will know whether you actually need what you're having or 'topping up' for calorie counts' sake.

It can be a difficult transition - even when you DO have all the info, so more so when you don't!

Best of luck hon, look foward to seeing how you get on. xx

 

[Dee 25]

thanks jan

well i changed my mind after your message earlier so here is what i have had today and think is ok going to count kcals this week but if dont loose might just try the 3 meals, was going to have 2 maintenance and then a meal at night but my lipotrim ladie said i wouldnt be having enough kcals. so we will see

i dont know if im having too much fruit i generally have grapefruit and apples, are these bad.

b:grapefruit and gluten free porridge
l:ham, b egg salad with beetroot and pickled onions
d: j potatoe with tuna and salad
mullerlight
s: apple and grapefruit

had loads of water and black tea

ive cut out diet drinks and not reintroduced milk, not bothered really

dee x

 

[JanD]

Are you sure your LT lady knows you want to continue to lose weight? When she says you won't be having enough calories - for what?

I don't know whether you've seen this - if not you may or may not find it helpful ..
http://www.minimins.com/weight-loss...0838-refeed-maintenance-weight-loss-plan.html

As far as apples & grapefruit are concerned - I don't think there's any restriction on types of fruit ... except perhaps bananas ... ? I wouldn't have more than one of each though, at first anyway. x

 

[Dee 25]

yeah thanks seen that
well only just reintroduced potatoes and fruit on day 6 and it was only small
cos im coeliac cant really overload on carbs
gonn see how i go may just av 3 meals

thanks for your help

dee

 

[summergurl]

Hey dee

Im with Jan on this one re the calories.
I think if you want to lose some more i think the best way to go about it is to start from day 1 of refeed and do it to the letter. Carry on doing that if you want for a second week if not then look at healthy eating and keeping to the portion sizes of refeed.

I think counting cals is misleading. Take it from me. I know when i tried to count cals i was eating things just because i was allowed x amount of calories. Never felt full as i always ate the wrong stuff and ended up lbs heavier each week.

Hope that helps a little.

With your pharmacist, im not sure either what she means you wont be having enough calories ..... does she actually know you want to lose more? If you are on refeed which i reckon she thinks you are then she shouldnt be telling you anything about calories etc

xxx

 

[Dee 25]

thanks you two

yeah she def knows i want to loose weight, i need about 10-12 in 6 weeks cos i go away.

i know what you mean about the kcals, well have really stuck to the refeed instructions of day 4-7 with the amounts of potatoe and fruit etc.

i have bought some maintenance caramel bars and orange cream shakes so may have one of them and 2 small meals.

she was adament that i should be having between 1000 and 1500 cals per day.

havent done bad today, but def gonna see tomo, but dont wanna under eat or overeat.

dee x

 

[Dee 25]

i have thought about what you said about starting the refeed from day 1 and i think you may be right so i will do it to the letter from tomo and see how i go.

should i weigh myself in the morning?

dee xx

 

[summergurl]

Its up to you Dee, if you wana weigh yourself go for it then you can weigh yourself a week from tomorrow and see how week 1 of refeed affected you.

You can keep up days 4-7 of refeed for aslong as you like

Keep us posted wont cha and any other problems, questions etc just ask us

 

[summergurl]

Don't want to seem like a twurp here but here is the refeed plan simpler. I know iris has already posted it but in that form to me its just a complete mouthfull to grasp :giggle: So don't shoot me down iris pweeeeease! :giggle:

Refeed Programme

DAY 1.

Have 2 Lipotrim servings and one meal, as follows (men continue to have 2 servings, as before, while women take 1 less serving of Lipotrim).

You may not have bread, grains (rice) or pasta until Day 4.
Fruit should wait until Day 4 at the earliest (later if you have carbohydrate problems).

You may have milk in tea/coffee.

At lunchtime or evening meal time you may have some skinless, boneless chicken breast or white fish fillet, or some skinless turkey (about 4-6ozs.) The fish or chicken may be steamed, microwaved, baked or cooked with a little water in a non-stick pan. Or you may have tuna fish in water or brine (drained). Vegetarians may use tofu or quorn.

You may also have either a moderate serving of salad (small breakfast bowl) from any of the following:
Lettuce
Cucumber
Cress
Watercress
Tomatoes
Mushrooms
Onions
Peppers
Bean sprouts
Celery dressed with a little lemon juice or wine vinegar
Or if you prefer, a moderate serving (2 heaped table spoons - no more)of some cooked vegetables.

DAY 2

You will have only 1 Lipotrim serving and 2 meals, as described for Day 1.

Day 3

Same as Day 2, but you may also have - at one meal only - an 8 ounce potato, plain boiled, mashed or baked, but with no addition of any fat. You may like to top with some skimmed milk, plain yogurt or very low fat fromage frais and a sprinkle of herbs.



Day 4-7

A Lipotrim serving for your breakfast plus:

Up to 3 serving of fruit (if you suffer from the insulin resistance problem, then eat these late in the day and do not snack on them during the day)

Up to 2 slices of bread or 1 pita or 1 roll or 1 bagel (without fatty spread)

Any vegetables you want except avocado, 1 or 2 servings with your meals (2 tablespoons per serving)

Any of the skimmed milk products.

Fish fillet (any size) or 6 ounces of chicken or turkey, as described before, or one tin of tuna in water or brine, drained. Vegetarians may use tofu, textured vegetable protein (TVP) or quorn.

Lean meat with all visible fat trimmed off

Low fat recipes prepared with low fat sauces - e.g. lean mince with low fat bolognese sauce

Medium baking potato or 6 small new potatoes or one serving of instant mashed potatoes (the kind with no added fat- read the label).

Instead of potato, you may have 4ozs of rice or pasta (cooked weight).

Sample menu for days 4 to 7.....


Sample 1

Breakfast: Lipotrim serving.

Lunch: Fish fillet (any type - cod, salmon etc), serving of potatoes ( 1 medium jacket or 6 new potatoes or a serving-spoon mash - no added fat) Yogurt ( low fat).

Diner: 4-6 ozs chicken (no skin), jacket potato, salad. Fruit (if appropriate) or low fat dessert.

Evening: Sandwich (no spread of any sort), consisting of: pickles, fat-free mayonnaise, salad/carrot, slice cold meat (low fat).

Snack 1 or 2 pieces of fruit (evening, if appropriate)




Sample 2

Breakfast: Lipotrim serving

Lunch: Sandwich (no spread) - any low fat filling, e.g. tuna. Bowl of salad. 2 pieces of fruit (if appropriate) or yoghurt.

Dinner: Spaghetti Bolognese, consisting of drained lean mince, low fat sauce, 4 ounces cooked spaghetti or rice, serving spoon of vegetables. Low fat dessert.

Snack or Evening: Tub of very low fat fromage frais, flavoured to suit with either slices of fruit or low fat jelly crystals for a sweet option or herbs and spices with added crunchy vegetable, for a savoury snack.

 

[Dee 25]

yeah that really helps
loads simpler, yeah def might do that and see how i go.
will weigh myself in the morning hopefully wont have put on.

so if i start from day 1 and then after the first week, keep on day 4-7 menu?

dee xx

 

[summergurl]

Yep sounds much better

 

[Scotsmist]

Well Tanya I am very upset indeed
haha - :8855::8855:as if!! Yours is so much simpler..so easier for Dee!

Dee, gonna put another spanner in the works.....you want to lose just under a stone...have you tried Rosemary Conley Inch Loss Plan..I did it the other week and in three weeks lost 9.5lbs! Didnt feel restricted in any way at all.
It was 1200 cals for week 1 and 2 and then it was upted to 1500 for week 3. It is such an easy diet to follow and probably does follow the lines of refeed in a way.
You have
breakfast 200 cals
snack 100 cals
lunch 300 cals
snack 100 cals
dinner 300 cals
milk allowance 200 cals

Then on Wk 3-4
an extra 300 cals.

You just have to watch the fat content as it is based on low fat so the 5% in 100g is usually followed.

just a wee suggestion if you want to lose a bit quicker and eat very healthy too.

I bought the book and i think a few others on the forum have too, but if you get the rosemary conley magazine it may have the diet in it!

Well done though on what you have achieved so far.

 

[Dee 25]

thanks everyone you been so kind

that rosemary conoly sounds good
but ill try this refeed firs and see how i go.then if i havent lost the weight i can give that a go.

gonna get weighed in a bit,

dee xx