Putting my faith in JUDD for Christmas Maintenance and Beyond...?

Sorry to hear things haven't been going as you'd like. Are you drinking enough? Do you feel bloated? Could it be hormones? Is there any recommendation in the book about what to do if you plateau or gain?

I think it's worth giving it time cos the law of averages with the calories on its own should lead to losses, and when the hormone for fat loss is activated with the swings in cals it really should be burning fat, but I wonder if its fat you are holding onto or something else (water??). That said it must be really disconcerting seeing gains when you are trying so hard as in your shoes I'd probably have gone back to VLCD by now! But stick with it, it's worth it xx
 
As I remember it, when you first start a VLCD they say record your losses from the first 3 days, ie, morning no 4, as this is generally water and glycogen weight and it's what you can expect to put on when you return to eating. I don't think your gains are any more than that and I know why you are panicking it's normal, especially after such a long time not eating. Not that I'm in a position to give anyone advice but it doesn't sound like you did a proper refeed after VLCD, when I stopped S & S I went straight to very lo carb for a month and my weight sts. Once I was sure it was stable I felt it was OK to go to another plan. I think your body is just adjusting to eating again and also possibly in a bit of shock.

Consider the positives, after xmas and new years had you not been doing JUDDD how much do you think you would have gained after stopping VLCD and enjoying the festive period? Most likely a helluva lot more than you have, for reference I wasn't on JUDDD and gained 10lbs!!! I went on SW and gained 2lbs as well so clearly on SW I was eating more than I normally would!! I know your VLCD was a ketogenic diet but you've been surviving on 650 cals a day for a very long time and the body is having to readjust it's chemistry set to deal with your new eating regime.

I think it's fab that you and other half have managed to support each other on the VLCD, but you might need to think about how things are going to go as you move forward into the next phase as the same solution for maintenance might not suit you both and as you say yourself you tend me be saints or sinners together, so that might be something to think about.

Just relax, eat healthily on UD and keep at the DD's as you have been, the weight will be gone in a few weeks and not a shake in sight. Good Luck !!!!!!!!!!!!
 
wannabslim said:
Sorry to hear things haven't been going as you'd like. Are you drinking enough? Do you feel bloated? Could it be hormones? Is there any recommendation in the book about what to do if you plateau or gain?

I think it's worth giving it time cos the law of averages with the calories on its own should lead to losses, and when the hormone for fat loss is activated with the swings in cals it really should be burning fat, but I wonder if its fat you are holding onto or something else (water??). That said it must be really disconcerting seeing gains when you are trying so hard as in your shoes I'd probably have gone back to VLCD by now! But stick with it, it's worth it xx
Click to expand...

Thanks for your support hun - I'm definitely sticking with it for now. Really need to give it a fair chance before I jump ship...and I've still got loads of lovely food in the house so don't really want to start anything too restrictive just yet!
Think I'm drinking enough, yeah. It's something I got into the habit of while I was VLCD-ing and I seem to have carried on afterwards. I always drink at least 2 litres of water with a little squash, and then I have at least one can of pop, a few cups of tea and/or fruit tea as well.
Having said that, I do think it's water weight, if it was food/fat, the scales would be swinging up after an UD not a DD I guess.

Lanarkwitch said:
As I remember it, when you first start a VLCD they say record your losses from the first 3 days, ie, morning no 4, as this is generally water and glycogen weight and it's what you can expect to put on when you return to eating. I don't think your gains are any more than that and I know why you are panicking it's normal, especially after such a long time not eating. Not that I'm in a position to give anyone advice but it doesn't sound like you did a proper refeed after VLCD, when I stopped S & S I went straight to very lo carb for a month and my weight sts. Once I was sure it was stable I felt it was OK to go to another plan. I think your body is just adjusting to eating again and also possibly in a bit of shock.

Consider the positives, after xmas and new years had you not been doing JUDDD how much do you think you would have gained after stopping VLCD and enjoying the festive period? Most likely a helluva lot more than you have, for reference I wasn't on JUDDD and gained 10lbs!!! I went on SW and gained 2lbs as well so clearly on SW I was eating more than I normally would!! I know your VLCD was a ketogenic diet but you've been surviving on 650 cals a day for a very long time and the body is having to readjust it's chemistry set to deal with your new eating regime.

I think it's fab that you and other half have managed to support each other on the VLCD, but you might need to think about how things are going to go as you move forward into the next phase as the same solution for maintenance might not suit you both and as you say yourself you tend me be saints or sinners together, so that might be something to think about.

Just relax, eat healthily on UD and keep at the DD's as you have been, the weight will be gone in a few weeks and not a shake in sight. Good Luck !!!!!!!!!!!!
Click to expand...

Thanks for popping in any giving me your thoughts...I do welcome any advice or suggestions.
I got to my goal weight on 11th November last year, and to be honest, I didn't do a low-carb re-feed because I hadn't been eating especially low carb as I approached goal (I did use VLCD packs but mixed and matched with normal food). Ketosis didn't really help me too much so I just concerntrated on keeping the calories low, and getting as much as I could out of my 650 calories!
I actually managed to drop to about 10st during those re-reed weeks (12lb ligher than I was on Wednesday). Ideally I would've liked to have carried on and stepped up to 1200, and then 1500, but Christmas was suddenly upon us so I had to make the change to JUDD sooner than I would've liked. I wasn't too worried about my gain over Christmas as it seemed in proportion to what I ate, but since then it seems to have gone a bit haywire!
To be honest, I think the initial water/glycogen gain came during my first JUDD week, and over Christmas I had a deserved gain (along with the rest of the water/glycogen) taking me to 10st 7lbs last week.... but what's happened since then is a bit of a mystery really. I'm obviously either retaining water, or my body just doesn't really know what to do at the moment!

This is yet further confirmed by what happened today! As you know, I weighed in at 10st 11.5 yesterday, which was after a DD. Yesterday itself was an UD and I ate 2500 calories worth of lovely food (burned 270 of them on the rower). This morning I got on the scales expecting to be in the 11s, and I was 10st 7.5!!!

4lbs off after an UD!? What's going on, lol?! Who loses 4lbs after a fairly big UD!? Not that I'm complaining obviously, I was living the dream! And I wasn't dehydrated either - I did my usual water intake and more besides yesterday :)

Anyway, today's a DD, and so far it's been really easy. I've had:
Covent garden carrot and corriander soup with added roast carrots and a little spinach:
Total: 150cals

And tonight I'm having:
Morrison's stuffed pepper:
Roast vegetables
Slim pasta
Tomato sauce
Total: 218 cals

Snacks will be milk in tea, jelly, fresh strawberries and raspberries, and maybe with a little yoghurt if I have calories to spare :)
 
Another good UD under my belt, and I'm definitely getting into the habit of making my meals bigger and my snacks fewer. For instance my lunch was a wrap with mexican chicken, salad and salsa, and I had it with cous cous and a side salad. The total was roughly 450 calories and I really enjoyed it. What's even bettter is that it filled me up for the afternoon :)
Tonight I've had a mushroom risotto from Morrison's (got it reduced but wouldn't bother getting it again) and I had it with roast carrots, parsnips, butternut squash and parmentier potatoes. Bit of an odd combination as the veg was supposed to go with a lamb shank until I remembered that the risotto was out of date!
Im still spending far too long thinking about what my evening snack will be - coffee cake AND chocolate today :-/ and I'm definitely thinking about food too much in general, but I'm hoping this will settle once I've got some regular meals in my repetoire and the novelty has worn off a bit!

Today has been a nightmare day in general (car battery discovered to have died at 6.30am...supposed to be at work for 7.30 but eventually got there at 10.45...stressed, hungry and with a pounding headache) so I'm not going to beat myself up too much about whether or not I actally *need* chocolate after I've already had cake (the answer would be yes today!) meaning that I'm now on about 2200 rather than the 2000 I was aiming for.

One thing im wondering is whether people eat back their exercise calories? I burnt 320 calories on the rowing machine so does that mean I should be aiming for 2300 rather than my usual 2000 or doesn't it matter?
X
 
Thanks hun....but that wasn't my official weigh-in day. That was the day before when I weighed 10st 11.5!
I've done strict alternates all week - sometimes crept slightly over my DD allowances, but not by more than 50 calories. I've tried to eat bigger, more nutritious meals on UDs with less emphasis on snacking, but to be honest it's been a battle and I'm beginning to think it always will be :(

I have this contant push-pull inside my head - one minute I'm thinking "Have it if you want it! it's an UD, not everybody counts everything on an UD...other people have wine and take-aways, and all you want is a Yorkie/ice cream/slice of cake/portion of chips"
And then if I do have it, about half an hour later I'll be thinking "well you ate it, you'd better work out the calories and record it"

I know that people do have days when they eat far more than 2000 calories, and I know that some people don't even count at all on UDs, but personally I seem to be obsessed with sticking to 2000, and so I'm constantly doing calculations in my head to work out what I can fit into my calories for the day!
It's not so bad during the daytime as I tend to eat the same things, but in the evenings I get quite obsessive about it. Say I've got 500 calories left, I can spend a good hour deciding what combination of cake, chocolate and other treats I can fit in to best make use of the calories I've got left!
Not exactly an intuitive or natural way of life is it?

And then I think I should be more kind to myself...this is all new to me - I've never tried to eat like a "normal" person...I've been losing or gaining huge chunks of weight for all of my adult life so it's not going to come easily to me, and food is still such a novelty to me - especially the notion of food without regret/guilt. In fact, I was staring at the food in Sainsbury's the other day when I realised that I have no idea what any of the full-fat ready meals taste like, because I've always been on a diet!
My fella thinks that I should come up with some meal plans, so that I have less thinking to do in the week when I come to do my shopping and cook my tea. The only problem is that it's been so long since I ate proper food that I've forgotten what kinds of things I like to eat when I'm not bingeing or starving! Weird hey?

I'm hoping that in time, I'll get into a routine and get a little list together of meals I enjoy and want to cook again. I'm also hoping that in time I'll be able to eat more intuitively on my UDs - say 250 cals for brekkie, 400 for lunch, 600-700 for tea, and then allow myself fruit/yoghurt snacks in the day and ONE desert/chocolate based treat in the evening that I don't necessarily weigh or measure (takes all the fun out of cake when you have to weigh it first!!)

So to sum up the week, I've been on a bit of a downer really - the scales jumped up again to 10st 10lbs mid-week, so I felt like I've been getting nowhere really. And last night I had a bit of a mini-binge - syrup sponge with ice cream, a Yorkie and half a lindt chocolate bar! Obviously me being me, it was all recorded on MFP and I ended the day on roughly 2500 cals so not too disastrous really.
Feeling like a glutton for punishment I got on the scales this morning and was actually pleasantly surprised with what I saw, but I'll weigh in officially tomorrow as it's a DD today. Knowing my body, I'll probably be heavier tomorrow though as I seem to be gaining after DDs! If so, I'll take today as my official WI, just cos I can ;)

Well I guess I should think about getting up - not sure whether I'll see my fella today because of the snow, so I might get my wellies out, go into town and get some ingedients to make some meals that I can freeze and eat during the week.
Sorry for the long rambly post, you must all think I'm completely nuts...and I'd probably agree, but writing things down does help...and I know I'll look back on this in a few weeks and see a difference in the way I'm thinking.

Hope everyone is safe in these snowy conditions! x
 
Dieting is all about the head work!! It's hard going xxx but your on the right track and I bet as you see more and more losses you might relax a little x x have a fab day :) x
 
Sounds to me your last diet messed with your head. It's going to take time to adjust so don't be so hard on yourself. xx I came to JUDDD from doing SW and even I struggle with letting go of calorie counting on UD's and I never had to do it on SW except for things that were synned. I also gained my first week on JUDDD but have lost that and more on the second week so I believe in it now. Before I had to take other people's word for it and I'm glad I did cos I was heading down the shakes route. You will get more relaxed in time xxx
 
Thanks for the replies :) I do appreciate everyone's advice and opinions.
I think it wasn't just my last diet that messed up my head if im honest...it's every diet that I've been on for the last 11 years. And also the fact that I know I'm capable of pressing the self destruct button, losing all control and burying my head in the sand until I've gained anywhere between 3-4 stone!
On the positive side, I think my recent VLCD history has taught me that I do have self control and willpower, and I'm in a slightly different position now than I've ever been before because I actually have acheived my goal weight - something that I never came close to doing before. I'm feeling positive that JUDD will allow me to loosen my grip on calories in a controlled way, whilst reminding me that I do still need willpower and a degree of control if I'm going to be a successful maintainer.
I'm still having good days and bad though...I'm still working on how many calories I have to 'spend' rather than thinking mindfully about whether I'm actually hungry and what it is that I really want to eat. I'm sure this is partly still the novelty of food, partly because I do have a lot of chocolate/desert in the house and partly a bit of 'last supper' mentality (quick -spend your 2000 calories now because tomorrow is a DD!)
I'm also having a few IDs here and there, mostly so I can manipulate my UDs for when I'm not with my boyfriend (he's still VLCDing). I seem to find that my weight is down after an UD, up after a DD (STRANGE!) but that it does seem to level out after an ID. For this reason, I'm going to have atleast one ID per week, and make my weigh in the day after.
It's hard to say what my start weight was because my weight was all over the shop after christmas, but I do remember 10st 12.5 being the heaviest weight I saw on the scales after new year. Yesterday was my weigh in day this week, and I'm really pleased to say that I'm down to 10st 6lbs :) :) :) which means I'm back within 1lb of my target weight! Hopefully by next weekend I'll be re-adding that maintainer badge to my profile!

Last night my boyfriend went out with his mates so I turned it into a treat day UD...I was going to order a take away but when I saw how close I am to being back at goal I decided not to. Instead I got a reduced pizza express pizza in Sainsburys, some garlic bread and some morazella sticks, and cooked myself the nicest meal I've had in ages! And what's even better is that I exercised some restraint with my portion sizes by only having half a mini garlic bread (200 cals) and only 3 mozarella sticks, rather than slapping the whole pack on the baking tray like I would've done years ago. The meal itself came in at about 1200 calories but I felt no guilt at all.. I'd only had porridge for brekkie, I'd walked into town and back, done 375cals worth of rowing, skipped lunch and felt like I well and truly earned it! Desert was half a chocolate brownie from an amazing cupcake cafe in town...it was so rich I only needed half, so I had it with ice cream and saved the rest for Monday.
After that I slipped up a little and had a bit of chocolate and stuff that I wasn't really hungry for, but I'm not beating myself up about it. I don't usually have treat days at weekends because I'm normally trying to be considerate towards my man, so I think I was just taking advantage of him not being there! All in all, I ended the day on about 2800 calories, but if you take exercise into account it was more like 2300-2400. Not bad for a big UD hey?

My mission for this week is to put a stop to fridge grazing and unnecessary picking. I shouldn't be doing it on a DD and there's no need on an UD. ..If I want it, put it on a plate and have it. Fridge grazing is such an unsatisfying half way house - you get the calories but without the enjoyment!
X
 
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Thank you :) Its does feel like a big relief to be back in my goal zone.
Had a good DD yesterday - had a quorn arribiata lunch pouch thing (think they're new but they're only 120 calories and REALLY nice) with some miracle noodles and extra veg. Would definitely buy that again, although I think it was quite expensive :(

Today's been an UD, but I've felt more relaxed about it today. I'm going to try to end the day with calories to spare - just to get out of the habit of using every last calorie available to me! I've also done better on the fridge-grazing front - only one toffee poppett and a couple of strawberries, and my snacking has seemed less bingey and more like a normal person's diet!

DD tomorrow, and I've got it all planned out and prepared. Should be easier than usual as I'm at the hairdressers in the evening so I'll be occupied and nowhere near the fridge!

Off to enjoy my leftover brownie now....mmmmmmm!
 
Well done! Just popping in to subscribe to your wonderful journey xx
 
Well I've had a pretty good week all round - had my big UD last Saturday (pizza day) and then strict aternates of <2000/500 until yesterday which was an ID at 1500.
This morning was my official weigh in - and I haven't weighed since last Saturday (also after an ID) so it was a bit of a tense moment - but I needn't have worried, because I've lost 2.5lbs this week, taking me to 10st 3.5lbs :D This means that I'm back under my goal weight of 10st 5lbs :) :D :)

I am so so so happy that JUDD seems to be working for me, and that I resisted the urge to do anything drastic when I gained over Christmas. I've dropped 9lbs since I started JUDDing properly in the new year, and I've still been able to eat lovely meals every other day :)
Now my next challenge/aim is to chill out a bit with calories. I still weigh and measure EVERYTHING - even on an UD, so I'd like to have at least one day a week, where I try to leave that aside and just enjoy what I fancy. This week seems like a good week to start, as I think I'm out for lunch with my colleagues one day this week - meaning that I won't know exactly what's in my food.
I'm also going out for drinks with my friend next Friday night so that'll mean a few extra calories that I probably won't count.
I know letting go of that strict control will seem weird at first, but I know I need to gradually let go of my kitchen scales, maybe not for things like cheese which is really easy to go OTT with, but it's a bit crazy to be measuring out 80g of frozen raspberries on an UD!

Anyway, that's enough reflecting/goal setting for now - Today I'm really happy with my weigh in result - VERY happy to be back within goal, and I'm going to go and enjoy my UD with a smile on my face :D
 
Good for you. I still weigh things out, largely so I can understand how many calories I'm consuming, but I know what you mean about getting rid of the scales for low calorie things and just concentrating on the more dangerous stuff. Are you hoping to maintain now? x
 
Umm, well I think ideally I'd like to lose a little bit more, just to give myself a bit of a comfort zone. I think maybe the top end of the 9's/bottom of the 10s is where I'll end up - so at least if I went away for the weekend/had a birthday etc. it wouldn't bounce me back above target.
Also, despite losing half my body weight, I'm *still* classed as being on the borderline of an overweight BMI, which isn't ideal. I know I'm not the slimmest person ever, and in theory I could lose another couple of stone and still be healthy, but the slimmer I get, the worse my loose skin seems so I need to get the balance right really.

Whatever I do, at least I don't have to be in any kind of hurry about it. Losing weight can be quite addictive so at some point I need to focus on learning proper maintanence tactics rather than trying to lose 'just a bit more'....

Enjoying my DD so far today. Toast and fruit/yoghurt for brekkie, tuna/cheese melt ciabatta for lunch, choccy treats in between, and a curry for tea, probably followed by a couple more treats :) But I have burnt 300 calories on the rower, and walked into and around town with my fella for well over an hour :D
 
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