The last stone mission......ROLL UP!!!!

[clairejen]

Morning all, I mysteriously gained a couple of pounds overnight, I'm feeling kind of sluggish this morning. And not looking forwards to work today, I have to start some programming which is going to be hard, part one is trying to remember how the original worked! Tonight I have dance cass, probably what I need to get everything moving.

Joanne, you frightened me with the C word again. I haven't even looked at cards, although I did pick up a present in Carcassonne for my sister and her OH as they are quite hard to buy for.

The Dukan book is a very slim volume, with a fair amount of waffle, and some rather odd science (to my mind). He has a theory that temperature plays a major role in weight loss, so if you are cold your body uses up a load of calories keeping itself warm. In my experience you just feel cold and hungry. It would be lovely if we could make our brown adipose fat work for us but I've never managed it. You'll probably get more out of it than I did, you french being much better than mine, I understand the words but not the nuances.

The galette - I use the egg white only version, I think I got it from Supertoinette originally. The yolk gets used up either as a sauce thickener or for enriching another egg dish (or if I get several I make ice-cream - guilty confession). Mix 1 egg white, 1 12ml spoon wheat bran, 2 12ml spoons oat bran, 1 12ml spoon fromage blanc (I use fat free fromage frais as that is all I can get here). Then I use a fine spray of oil to make sure it doesn't stick in the pan, spread it out with a spatula and cook until slightly browned, turning once. It stays together well enough to turn. I always eat mine fresh but some say they transport theirs. It makes one medium size or two small thin crepes. I like the nutty flavour of the bran, and it is the closest you get to carbs on the diet!

Good luck with the diet, you have a big advantage in that you can actually buy all the ingredients while I had to improvise for some. Do keep me informed of how you get on, when I tried it I liked the food but it didn't like me much.

Hi Tasha and Ida.

 

[Maintainer]

I typed out a long post, then lost it, and am about to run out... thanks SO much Claire for your receipe, which does indeed make it look easy. I never eat breakfast until I'm at work though so I'll have to see how that galette travels!

The hardest thing for me I think will be yoghurts/fromage blanc which I absolutely detest... as I used to say to new dieters on another board when they'd come on and say that they wanted to lose weight but didn't like salads or vegetables: "you soon will when you get hungry". I guess I'll have to apply that principle to myself!!

 

[clairejen]

I hate it when I lose posts, so frustrating. Are you OK with the yogurt/fromage frais in recipes? I seem to remember you aren't keen on egg custard things either, or is my memory failing (again)? There is no need to have them if you don't like them, it just means you have more meat products instead. There is a strange egg based bread which uses a bit of cornflour, not allowed in the attack phase, which I can't say I actually liked but bread was something I really craved so it was better than nothing.

Back to the grindstone for me, my mood is worsening by the second!

 

[Maintainer]

You're absolutely right. I really don't like eggy things which move! (so egg custard, flan, confectioner's custard, creme brulee, etc definitely not for me...)

BUT there is a light on the horizon. I've just been chatting to one of the three girls I've learned who are doing Dukan in my office. One, like me, hates everything about natural yoghurt and has been eating BA (Bifidus Actif) Vanille 0% which is apparently OK. hmm. Will try.

Otherwise, she's been having smoked salmon with galette most mornings, or with a chopped up boiled egg, so that encourages me as I like those ideas!

I can't honestly see me cooking with eggs, aside from the morning galette, with the 3-4 yolk restriction per week. Unless I mailed you all the yolks (wink), I'd begrudge each and every farm egg yolk going in the bin!

So I start on Monday. 4 days pure protein... then 3 or 4 protein legumes, then 3 or 4 pure protein again. I plan to avoid having PP on weekends!

Meanwhile, I continue being mega strict so won't have wild losses on Dukan, as will be going into it on the back of a steep weight loss already, but at least it might help me get those last 7lbs off that I've not managed once since quitting smoking and also, of course, the fewer pounds I have to lose, the fewer x 10 days I have to stabilise for! That part of the whole plan is what "sold" it on me, to be honest. Stabilisation has to be the most difficult thing and for a doctor to recommend 10 days per kilo lost strikes me as being very long, but probably about right... what do you think Claire?

Sorry to hear that your mood is worsening... I must admit that I almost cried earlier, while preparing my 4pm apple, realising that it'll be one of the last pieces of fruit I'll be eating in quite a while! Such a shame that, with clementines everywhere!!

 

[clairejen]

The programming is going better than expected (hope saying that isn't inviting problems tomorrow). At least I can understand the basic principles of what I did last time. Now I just have to make my clever idea of how to program an acceleration work as well in code as it does in my head! Feeling happier with life anyway. Dancing tonight, it always givs me a boost.

I used to have smoked salmon sometimes with the galette, and microwaved mushrooms which I maintain don't count as anything. Much as I would love to have free range egg yolks I think I'll have to pass on that one! Apart from icecream they are useful for pate sucree and brisee, you can always freeze the empty pastry shells for when the diet is over.

I think the long stabilisation period is about right to be honest. And it is very good about allowing things, even croissants and wine. The main rule is restraint, as things are reintroduced you can have one serving but only one. Then after stabilisaton there is just the one day a week PP for life, Thursday for some reason, although you can choose another day if you prefer. Did you get the book? I'm interested to know what you think about it, I felt it was written rather egocentrically but that might be down to my limited french.

 

[KD]

atural yoghurt and has been eating BA (Bifidus Stabilisation has to be the most difficult thing and for a doctor to recommend 10 days per kilo lost strikes me as being very long

Funny you should say that. I looked into Dukan before I chose Cambridge. It looked great, but I couldn't understand the phase 3 bit. I was going to have to be on it for one and half years The Cambridge refeeding (which I guess is the same idea) would only take 6-8 weeks).

Now. It did occur to me that I must have something wrong here, but I couldn't find anything different, so decided to abandon that idea.

Do think it's strange though.

 

[clairejen]

It seems to me that maintenance is a much harder phase than weight loss (says she struggling with a couple of pounds!). How many times have we seen people lose brilliantly then regain just as much or more? There are some people who manage it by themselves, hats off to Karion and Joanne here, but there are others, myself included, who need a bit more structure. Dukan is a very low carb diet, similar to Atkins in some respects, and I imagine you will get some metabolic adjustment to the lower intake. So a slow stabilisation phase would have the double benefit of getting your intake and metabolism increasing at the same rate and instilling sensible, restrained eating habits.

That's just my take on it, may be totally off course here. I would have done Dukan happily if I could face the meat!

 

[Maintainer]

Actually Karion (and hello and glad you're still posting here!),

I read most of the book last night (it's on order, won't arrive until next week, so a friend let me photocopy it so I'm reading her copy). Karion, funny that you should pick up on the "Phase 3 Stabilisation" period as it's true that while it was initially something which bothered me too as being over lengthy, having struggled to stabilise and maintain (and having seen SO MANY people here struggling to stabilise and maintain after CD or LL), I have totally changed my way of thinking.

I initially lost 72 kilos so ought to have followed a stabilisation programme for over 2 years. Lengthy perhaps, but with some structure in my stabilisation I might have found it easier. Phase 3 stabilisation is nothing like CD/LL maintenance either as you are reintroducing lots of things, including "3 course meals":

3/ in this phase you're also allowed 2 full unrestricted meal per week but with the following guidelines:
- 2 meals not 2 days
- no refill !
- the 2 meals have to be apart by at least a day

You're allowed to have a whole lunch or dinner, including wine and desert. Of course, you need to be moderate, if you're planning to drink a whole bottle of wine, have some Queso and finish with a whole cheesecake, you missed the point. Those 2 meals are bringing diversity and quality, don't make them orgies. I would suggest going to some fine restaurant with reasonable serving sizes.

Enjoy those frugal meals, Take the time to appreciate the savors you're rediscovering. Question yourself about the subtlety of the food you're enjoying.
​

So I've decided to start on Monday. I don't expect a miraculous weight loss as I'm going into it after a week of being strict (so far lost 9.5lb in 3 days, but remember I did gain an incredible 13lbs in 10 days on holiday). What I'm hoping, by following a proper structured programme for once, is to get back to target (quickly - yeah I need a quick fix!), into my wardrobe again, and then use the stabilisation phase for a long time until I can get properly stable again. This yoyoing can't be healthy for me.

Claire - thanks so much for your enthusiasm and encouragement. I do feel really psyched up to do it, and have sent OH to the local supermarket today to check out the yoghurt labels for me (I hate natural yoghurt with a vengeance and fruit ones, even 0%, aren't allowed in first phase!).

As for the book, and the tone, I found it "easy reading" in that he didn't get too technical for me (which I find difficult to read in ANY language), but I must admit that he got my back up with his references to "le gros" or "l'obèse"... I know that one doesn't need to be "politically correct" in France seemingly (and hallelula for that!) BUT I found those words offensive!

There are even some pages at the back about weight gain after quitting smoking. While he doesn't condone my gain, he explains it (not only the nibbly thing but also the fact that one's body does use all the calories as it should in a non smoker, whereas in a smoker the nicotine helped "consume" them...

So weigh in this morning good... (obviously the more I can lose before Monday, the fewer days I need to do on Attack, then PP/PL to get to target... but of course the weight loss will be less remarkable too)

 

[KD]

Well, I suppose when you think about it, after CD I did calorie count for a year, so I guess I was doing something structured for at least 14 months after goal.

Very best of luck girls. Look forward to hearing more details

 

[KD]

Just out of interest, how many days are you doing on the attack phase? Need more details of what you are eating. In fact, need more details of everything. Always interested in various diets:clap:

Any chance of explaining the phases in your own words, particularly phase one and two?

 

[clairejen]

Morning, we have stormy weather threatened today and I am trying to put off starting my programming. Dancing was fairly energetic, I need something to get my muscles rebuilt a bit, I feel very flabby. I've got to get a report done for the committee meeting tonight (for our drama group), so no rest for me today.

The two pounds have gone again, now 9st9lbs. Yoyo isn't the word, I'm gettting dizzy here.

Joanne, I know you don't like artificial stuff but to make the yogurts palatable you might like to try some flavouring and sweetener. There is a huge discussion thread on flavourings on Supertoinette (these girls take it all waaaay too seriously). This is the favoured source:
Arômes alimentaires
I think what annoyed me about the book was his desire to talk about himself and how he developed the diet. I realise without it the book would be barely a pamphlet!

Karion, stabilisation and maintennance is the most important bit whatever diet you are doing. I think that's where I didn't like Cambridge, the steps try to push you into low GI which I didn't really like. You did really well after your weight loss, you are a shining example to us all. I'll let Joanne do the translation, her french is way better than mine.

Hi Tasha and Ida, hope all is going well.

 

[Maintainer]

grrr got loads of work, and boss has been here all night (crazy lady) so she's not very tolerant today!

I've been toying with how many days to do on phase 1 Attack and, to get a decent head start, I'm going to go for four days. Mon to Thursday next week. Fri to Sun inc. will be Protein and legumes, Phase II, then from that point on either Mon to Thurs each week PP, and Fri to Sun PL or the reverse if I need to...

 

[KD]

Karion, stabilisation and maintennance is the most important bit whatever diet you are doing.

Oh I agree...wholeheartedly!!

I think that's where I didn't like Cambridge, the steps try to push you into low GI which I didn't really like. You did really well after your weight loss,

When I did Cambridge the plans were different. They may have been low GI, no idea. I hated it though. Kicked and screamed throughout

Think I was so desperate to get onto my own plan. I knew that I had to do the stabilisation bit, but really wanted to go it alone, so moaned through the 8 weeks

It worked though, like I should imagine Dukan will and I would think that if you needed that structure of stabilisation for a long time then it would suit. After all, many people keep some kind of structure throughout their lives, what's a mere year or two. Besides, it's much more flexible than the likes of Cambridge stabilisation. It would be easier to keep it going long term. So, nothing against it, just that it did seem and extraordinarily long time.

I've been toying with how many days to do on phase 1 Attack and, to get a decent head start, I'm going to go for four days. Mon to Thursday next week. Fri to Sun inc. will be Protein and legumes, Phase II, then from that point on either Mon to Thurs each week PP, and Fri to Sun PL or the reverse if I need to...

Sounds good to me. Dead exciting having a new plan eh

 

[Maintainer]

it's true that I do feel motivated and excited at the thought of doing something different (even if I am going to miss fruit no end); if I can get rid of this last bit once and for all, "stablilisation" Dukan style looks like exactly what I need... albeit I'm a bit close to Christmas to do it "properly" at this stage... but I fear if I don't do something soon, I'm just going to end up accepting my weight as it is... and never ever get into my slim wardrobe again!

Better dash - by the way, friend went to health food shop at lunchtime and picked up the wheat germ and oat bran; doesn't that look appealing NOT... the thought of mixing that up with fromage blanc 0% (yuck), and an egg white (double yuck), and eating it for breakfast does not appeal! Still, if it looks like a galette, I can kid myself it's a crepe and serve smoked salmon with it

 

[clairejen]

I know the ingredients don't look like anything you want to put in your mouth and when you mix them up they look like vomit (I'm not trying to put you off, honest), but when they start to cook they smell lovely and I think the taste is great. Firmer and crisper than a normal sarrasin galette but the flavour is similar. I believe the loss is very quick, you get into ketosis because of the low carb, so it shouldn't be long before you can start having some fruit again. Good luck with it, I'm sure it will work well for you.

Karion, I hated the steps too and skipped through them way too fast. Probably why I put some weight on again! All that is gone now and I am at the same weight I was when I finished Cambridge, unfortunately still 2lbs more than I want to be.

 

[idaj]

Hi all - havent really had time to update

Holiday was great, we had a brilliant time apart from the czech prostitutes scaring me witless (!!) So the boy drove me to germany to sleep there


Have had a very busy week, both school and workwise - lots of reports etc for uni, studying for exams, and I've had 3 shifts this week (24hrs total) - I need some cash for xmas pressies!!

Boyfriend was very sweet today, was at a hospital which is a fair bit away (I bike everywhere - was about 10km in a really harsh wind). I go out to find my bike at 11pm after shift, and i see flowers in my basket. I think "wow, the patients must really have liked me" (!!!) until he steps out of the darkness and gives me a big hug. He also gave me tickets for the train home (and my bike!) so I didnt have to cycle home, and he made me dinner too (on plan, very sweet of him). Sometimes I feel like the luckiest girl in the world.

I haven't really had a chance to read the messages that you've all written - sorry - but I hope all is well with you all.

Weight is down to 58.8kg, so only 9lbs to go.

Lots of love, Ida xxxxxxx

 

[tashy100]

Hello All

Been a busy week and am off to Brighton (where husbands parents live) with my immediate family and we are getting married again!!!! My husband is muslim and we are having a muslim ceremony and then going out for an all-you-can-eat thai meal!!!! Great for the waistline then!!

Idaj - I know what you mean about the czech prostitutes - my husband worked in Prague for a while and I went out for some weekends - my god what a nightmare - not that I felt left out at all because I got invited too!!!!

Joanne - LOADS of that weight put on gone in a flash - well done you!! You sound very motivated for this Dukan diet - be very interested to see how you go - be great to see the type of things you get to eat if you have time to tell us.

Claire - hope you are feeling better and that the scales are being kind.

Weight this morning - hold on - just have to weigh......11/7 - feel reasonably good about that - am not trying too hard just eating a bit more sensibly - also its possible I might be pregnant (arghrghrghrghrghrghg) - will find out in a few days and if so will try to maintain - not gain but not lose either.

Have a lovely day and a great weekend!!

Tasha

 

[clairejen]

Hi all, lovely to see the thread so busy. I've still got a bit of code to finish, fortunately the main bit worked well so it is only tweaking left. Scales up after the UD yesterday, but only a pound, so it isn't too bad. I'm going to be on my own this weekend so I need to plan meals or I might end up eating all sorts of stupid things.

Ida, how sweet your BF is, what a lovely thing to do. I hope you get some relaxation time this weekend, your life sounds so hectic that just reading about it makes me tired! Well done on the weight loss, you'll be there in no time.

Tasha, a second wedding - will you be wearing your dress again? Congratulations on the pregnancy, you have a lot of changes in your life all at once.

Joanne, enjoy your last weekend of fruit. Looking at your ticker you should only be dieting for about three weeks before you can introduce more things, it really isn't that long a time.

 

[Maintainer]

I don't believe this! I posted to this thread this morning (I thought!) and I've lost it, grrr! I wish they'd stop distracting me here WITH WORK! Anyone would think that was what I was here for!

Sorry can't chat - have a great weekend everyone - and despite the transport people having put in notice of an UNLIMITED STRIKE from Wednesday next, I shall be aiming to start Monday and have been working out menus... Hope you're right Claire re 3 weeks only! I doubt it'll come off that fast, though but it would be great. I'll be sure to eat plenty of fruit and carbs too (just no treats) so that there's something to be eaten away on Monday!

 

[clairejen]

Hi folks, and a thoroughly wet and miserable day it is too. David went off sailing at 6.30 this morning (he must be mad) and I have the house to myself until Sunday night. Scales showed 9st8.75lbs, less than two pounds away now (again, I seem to be saying this ad nauseam). I hope you are all having a great weekend, enjoy your final days of fruit Joanne.