KD Rambles No. 2 Food addiction and peptides

[minilady]

*This latest time* I lost my weight through a self-devised healthy(ish) eating plan as I needed to learn (seemingly from scratch, as it had been so long since I'd eaten healthily) how to do so. Perhaps that's why now I cast my eye over other people's food menus, whether they're dieting or not, with SUCH a critical eye. Hmm...

I have great admiration for you. To work on yourself first and then as a by product of that to then lose weight is wonderful. By doing a VLCD I have had to do this the other way round. Lose weight, then consentrate on the head stuff.

Your method has been successful for you and it is extremely understandable that you would scrutinise others peoples methods of dieting, and consumption. I think we all do this to some extent, I know I certainly do, I even did it pre diet I would watch others and although I'd never dream of voicing my thoughts, I'd still think critically. Then in secret I'd be filling my face with exactly the same things and in probably a bigger quantity

I like Karion's analogy above (and wish I could handle quoting things). It's true that the word "diet" obviously equates to the desired result of weight loss, but as long term "been there, done that, and put all the weight back on" dieters, we just KNOW that it's not the end of the journey.

I am looking into things "this time" which I didn't last time. Although I maintained for three years, I realise now that I leant heavily on my crutch regularly during the day (cigarettes), so I became very "wobbly" without it. Even now, six months after quitting, hearing that fellow quitters have taken up the habit again and LOST weight gives me a pang... I so don't want to hear this![/quote]

I'm a smoker and when I was ssing I smoked double what I had been Things seem to be settling down now and I'm back to about 15 a day (still bad I know). In an ideal world I'd like to maintain for about a year, in which time I hope to have found a way to cope with my addictive desires. Then will be the task of quitting smoking

My husband gave up smoking 2 years ago, he's a large chap anyway and managed to put on 3 stone more after he quit. His weight peaked after about 5 months and since then he has gradually lost the extra weight and is back to his pre-quitting weight. He has not dieted in anyway

Tracey
x

 

[KD]

I think the three of us ARE actually singing from the same song sheet, despite what I've typed above.

I know. Guess I said that for the benefit of others that might just lurk on this thread.

and wish I could handle quoting things

It's dead easy you know. Just knowing how to do it.

There are two ways.

1. Highlight the bit you want to quote and press

Or

2. Write the following either side what you want to quote [ quote] and at the end [ /quote] Remove the spaces I had to put in to stop it quoting

 

[Maintainer]

Highlight the bit you want to quote and press

WOW! but I haven't got the bit who says who posted that!

Your method has been successful for you and it is extremely understandable that you would scrutinise others peoples methods of dieting, and consumption.

Thank you Minilady but, unfortunately as you'll see from my ticker, I have regained quite a bit since quitting smoking so am finding there are many unresolved issues in my messed up mind still.

As an aside, I think from the photo under your user name that you're a fellow cat person... just to let you know (and I ought to let Mini know too) that I've named my new kitten, currently just five weeks old, Minnie...

 

[KD]

WOW! but I haven't got the bit who says who posted that!

If you press the 'quote' button instead of the reply button, it will come up automatically, but only for the first quote.

You can add it yourself if you want by adding '=name' after [quote

For example

WOW! but I haven't got the bit who says who posted that!

 

[KD]

I have tinnitus. It’s one of the side effects of having meniere’s disease. Most of the time my tinnitus is controlled i.e. I have it 24/7 but can block it out a lot of the time:clap:

Well, they’ve worked out that most people don’t respond to drugs and are now recommending Tinnitus Retraining Therapy which evidently has a 75% success rate!

So I’ve been reading up about it and am amazed to see how similar the therapy is to what I am doing with this AD thingy.

Examine your reaction to tinnitus or unpleasant external sounds (in hyperacusis) for some (short) periods each day. 10 seconds is long enough

Examine my reaction to AD. Does it make me reach for food, or is it just a thought. Keep practicing. 10 seconds is usually long enough.

Practice relaxation techniques to reduce the body (autonomic activity) part and try to reduce you annoyance / irritation / fear (limbic part) by an 'act of diplomacy'. Don't worry if you can't reduce these things by much, every little counts, and each time the exercise will be easier.

Practice relaxing when accepting the AD to reduce my annoyance/irritation/fear.

This is an exercise in facing the object of your disaffection without reacting to it so strongly, an exercise in diplomacy. It is important not to do too much to start with. Flooding yourself with unpleasant tinnitus experiences, or too much environmental sound to which you are aversive, can make things worse. As with desensitiation to an allergy, progress must be very slow and deliberate. An average period for retraining might be 18 months, or more in severe cases.

That first bit really stood out for me. Facing the AD. Having trigger foods around, but not flooding myself with them which can make things worse. Taking it slowly, but practicing regularly.

Think positively about the REAL meaning of tinnitus or external sound

Think positively about what AD.really is.

Increase the period of this exercise gradually, by seconds, then maybe minutes. Slow progress, little and often, works best! If you try to rush it, you can go backwards.

Right there matey!

Anyway, this is what the NHS are now recommending for tinnitus because of it’s high success rate. I’m pretty sure I’m not imagining a similarity here

 

[canireallydothis!!]

Im liking that KD, think the main thing for me was the "flooding". I thought I could do it all at once and it backfired big time.

Hmmm, thanks x

 

[KD]

Did you know that they’ve now proved that people can get biologically addicted to sugars and fats? Or if not addicted, certainly have biological cravings.

It was always thought that you couldn’t get biologically addicted to food as you need to eat, to grow. Fats that we eat makes our brains respond in a positive way which makes us want to eat more, but it seems that the fat activates these proteins called peptides which stimulate appetite and stimulate feelings of addiction.

There are non opiate peptides and opiate peptides. The non opiate peptides make us enjoy certain foods and as such make us want more, but the more we have the more the opiate peptides come about. The opiate peptides cause the cravings. You don’t even have to digest the peptides. Even if it was just injected straight into your bloodstream, you would have the same problem. It would still affect the structure of the brain and its thought that these peptides interfere with the satiety process, making you hungry quicker and craving foods high in fat.

Fascinating stuff. Just a little bit of the puzzle though.

 

[canireallydothis!!]

So if I had IV pizza Id crave it????

 

[KD]

I think it's a bit more complex than that. They tested people on high carb vs high fat, and found that people were hungrier 1-2 hours after eating the high fat meal than those on the high carb meal.

So that would be the satiety factor caused by the peptides, but there is more to it. If you have sugar or fats, you are more likely to want more of the same, but repeated 'doses' seem to cause real cravings similar to those of a drug addict. I'm not sure how long it takes for the opiate peptides to increase enough to cause a problem.

It seems that research is still in the very early stages as scientists have been barking up the wrong tree. They have only just started looking for addictive qualities in the actual nutrients themselves.

So basically, as I understand it, if we eat high fat, we will be hungrier quicker, but also, the high fat stimulates the non-opiate and opiate peptides.

As a young child, we may have a high meal, which would stimulate the non-opiate peptides which make us think "hey...that was nice...wouldn't mind a bit more of that". We would then feel hungrier quick and be drawn to another high fat food. Even animal and humans tested chose the high fat foods at this point even though they enjoyed both of the food groups.

Anyway, gradually, the opiate peptides start multiplying and it stops being "wouldn't mind having a bit more" and starts becoming "I must have more".

So, it's a vicious circle. After all, we must have fats to keep us well. It's getting the balance, and also dealing with those cravings so that we can step out of that circle.

So there are chemical addictions and psychological habits (AD). If we can win the war on the psychological habits (which probably include foods mainly high fat, but also other types), then we can control the chemical addiction better.

Does that make sense?

 

[KD]

Okay...nobody thinks it makes sense Why am I doing this

Was going to do something about rituals, but think I might be wasting my time, so will change the subject and talk about the stressful last 24hours in Karion Land.

Part 1
All was well until the early hours of this morning. 2:30am and I go upstairs to bed. DS2 (aged 15) is in the bathroom. He comes out and he's as white as a sheet. He's clasping his head and moaning "Mum...make it go away...make it go away".

Now, DS2, like DS1 is extraordinarily healthy. Neither of them have been plagued with colds or stomach upsets. Perhaps they instinctively know that I do not have any natural nursing qualities I'm fine for a day, but after that, I'm bored with giving tender loving care and just want to get back into my routine

But here he was suffering big time.

He wanted to sleep but couldn't as his head just hurt too much. A headache? Don't remember him ever having a headache, though surely he must have done at some time.

DS2 can't make it to his bed. He's on the floor, still clasping his head and moaning quietly to himself. "It hurts, it hurts"

My first thought is meningitis. Guess I was in dramatic mood, but this was such odd behaviour for him, it had to be serious.

Oh my goodness, this is serious. I have suggested pain killers and he's accepted He's never accepted, not even a travel sickness tablet before a long journey. "Can't do tablets"

I know he will heave on it. That's DS2 for you. I crush it up with honey and bring a drink of water (DS2's favourite beverage)

10 minutes later and he's still rolling in pain. I've managed to get him to bed though and do the usual stroking of the brow. Must admit I was getting very nervous and imagining the worst.

He tells me to go to bed, and I'm wondering if my presence is stopping him sleeping, so I go.

I lie in bed worried. Don't know what is going on. Is he being sick? Is the headache getting better? Is he still alive? I go back and ask him if he'd like to come into my bed (DH works nights). I want him with me. I want to know what's happening.

He says "Yes" which supprised me. Probably not correct to sleep with one's son at this age, but it felt right. This morning he is fine

Very odd.

Part 2

Had 2 teeth out today. Can't count the times that I've been to the dentist to have these out and then it's been called off when I got there as the time hasn't been right (infections....busy week etc). I've got a really bad record for nothing going straightforward when it comes to my teeth, so the conditions had to be perfect.

Today was (according to Mr Lovely Dentist) 'perfect'. Damn! Still, they are out, and it looks as if it was a straightforward job. Face isn't swollen, black and blue, and unlike previous extractions, it doesn't look like I will be passed a card from a stranger giving me the address of the nearest womans refuge :clap:

So, no pain, hardly any discomfort. My dentist is fab. Such a sweetheart. Unlike previous dentists, he doesn't expect me to have a dislocated jaw that opens like a python. Neither does he quickly turn away if I've had garlic the night before :clap:

In return, I clean my teeth correctly with a good toothbrush and sometimes floss. Refuse to floss night and morning, cos it's not natural. When was the last time you read a book which said "As the lovers lay there muttering sweet nothings in each others ears, the both jumped up instantaneously, realising they hadn't flossed"?

So, all is well, so why have I given myself permission to comfort eat since getting back. Why??

 

[Maintainer]

awh Karion - I sympathise with the two extractions having had one myself a few months ago; as to why you're comfort eating, that one is beyond me! (I didn't dare eat for while in case soemthing got stuck in the hole!!

It sounds as if you did all the right things in the night although I must admit that I don't have a maternal bone in my body EXCEPT where cats and kittens are concerned!

Could your mind be turning to the "rentree scolaire", as they call it over here ("back to school"? we don't have a term for it in English, do we?). After such a long break, it must be pretty daunting to be facing another term, no?

 

[KD]

awh Karion - I sympathise with the two extractions having had one myself a few months ago; as to why you're comfort eating, that one is beyond me! (I didn't dare eat for while in case soemthing got stuck in the hole!!

doesn't seem to faze me Trying to eat on the other side. Mr Lovely Dentist said to drink on the other side too. How do you do that? Lie down and drink I suppose Doesn't it just dribble out again

After such a long break, it must be pretty daunting to be facing another term, no?

I've loved this holiday. More than any other. It's been really relaxing, but mainly because I mislaid my todo list. Must remember to do that next time. It's so much better :clap:

I've started getting back into the groove now though. The last week I've been setting myself 4hours a day for school work prep

Back to school tomorrow just for the mornings...on and off. Kids back on the 3rd Sept (privately) and 5th for school. Looking forward to it in a way as it's easier to keep the food in sensible proportions when I have a routine.

Still....haven't put on any weight, but it's just a bit more scary. Having to think more about it.

I know that if I do put on, it'll go once school has finished, but it's hard to let go.

 

[Maintainer]

It didn't occur to me to ask my dentist beforehand how I'd eat afterwards and by the time she'd finished with me talking coherently wasn't an option so I waited for my mouth to defrost before eating soup; I did take mints with me to suck though, as I remembered that nasty metallic taste until you can drink properly!

I'm a big list writer. Writing a "to do" list is therapeutic to me. Almost as if I've done the things on that list.

 

[minilady]

As an aside, I think from the photo under your user name that you're a fellow cat person... just to let you know (and I ought to let Mini know too) that I've named my new kitten, currently just five weeks old, Minnie...

Do you have any pics of new kitten? Great name

Okay...nobody thinks it makes sense Why am I doing this

Part 1
All was well until the early hours of this morning. 2:30am and I go upstairs to bed. DS2 (aged 15) is in the bathroom. He comes out and he's as white as a sheet. He's clasping his head and moaning "Mum...make it go away...make it go away".

DS2 can't make it to his bed. He's on the floor, still clasping his head and moaning quietly to himself. "It hurts, it hurts"

My first thought is meningitis. Guess I was in dramatic mood, but this was such odd behaviour for him, it had to be serious.

Oh my goodness, this is serious. I have suggested pain killers and he's accepted He's never accepted, not even a travel sickness tablet before a long journey. "Can't do tablets"

10 minutes later and he's still rolling in pain. I've managed to get him to bed though and do the usual stroking of the brow. Must admit I was getting very nervous and imagining the worst.

I lie in bed worried. Don't know what is going on. Is he being sick? Is the headache getting better? Is he still alive? I go back and ask him if he'd like to come into my bed (DH works nights). I want him with me. I want to know what's happening.

He says "Yes" which supprised me. Probably not correct to sleep with one's son at this age, but it felt right. This morning he is fine

Very odd.

I would have been worried too, I'm glad he is feeling fine today My eldest is 17 and if she's ill or upset she still sleeps in with me too!

Part 2

Had 2 teeth out today. Can't count the times that I've been to the dentist to have these out and then it's been called off when I got there as the time hasn't been right (infections....busy week etc). I've got a really bad record for nothing going straightforward when it comes to my teeth, so the conditions had to be perfect.

I can sympathise with teeth pulling I also have problems with my teeth, well actually it's my gums, but I too get infections galore and have had to had lots out.

So, no pain, hardly any discomfort. My dentist is fab. Such a sweetheart. Unlike previous dentists, he doesn't expect me to have a dislocated jaw that opens like a python. Neither does he quickly turn away if I've had garlic the night before :clap:

Sounds too good to be true


So, all is well, so why have I given myself permission to comfort eat since getting back. Why??

Not only do I comfort eat when times are telling, but also after things have settled down and all is well I overeat then too, maybe by eating once everything is ok again, in my subconscious I'm rewarding myself for getting through it, or perhaps I feel I need to stock up incase things go wrong again.

Lol Although I know I do it, I don't really understand why.

Worrying about your son and your trip to the dentist is all very stressful, and even though all is ok now, the feelings of concern you've been having still are still fresh in your mind.

KD I have full faith that you'll come up with a theory regarding this, can't wait to read it

Take care

Tracey
x

 

[clairejen]

I'm wondering if your son picked up some unpleasant virus - I've had very quick acting infections which made me feel I was dying in the night but then been fine the next day. Might be worth mentioning to the doctor, they'll certainly know any strange bugs doing the rounds.

That dentist's trip sounds traumatic, no matter how nice they are it is hard not to get stressed. And there is a very strong link between comfort eating and stress, maybe this was just too big an event to treat rationally.

 

[KD]

KD I have full faith that you'll come up with a theory regarding this, can't wait to read it

Of course I have a theory I'll save it for another day though

 

[KD]

I'm wondering if your son picked up some unpleasant virus - I've had very quick acting infections which made me feel I was dying in the night but then been fine the next day. Might be worth mentioning to the doctor, they'll certainly know any strange bugs doing the rounds.

Bless him. He doesn't 'do' doctors Neither boy does...nor DH. Don't think they are even aware they have one

That dentist's trip sounds traumatic, no matter how nice they are it is hard not to get stressed. And there is a very strong link between comfort eating and stress, maybe this was just too big an event to treat rationally.

Nah. Would be nice to think that applied to me, but it would just be an excuse in my case. I know that eating doesn't make me feel better. I do like to think that it's a perfect reason for me, but I know that it is just an excuse.

At the moment I'm having a slightly tougher time than I've had for ages. Mainly because I'm due back at school soon, so my old head is telling me I could go off plot for now and pick up then. I keep thinking "what does it matter...it'll be easier to be 'good' when I'm back at school and I'll soon lose it again" It's madness though.

Really, I'd be saying "hey! I could eat for the next few days and feel crap again....wouldn't that be a great way to finish the holidays". See....bizarre.

So, to the get the best out of my last few days, I will continue to do what the new Karion does, not the old stuff that messed me up.

That's the perfect reward I can give myself. Eat well, feel fab. Or eat rubbish, have a few moments of fun, then feel crap.

No contest. There is no start and finish to maintaining. Donning my Dr Spock hat tells me that eating too much will never make me feel better, it's just the addict in me that finds any reason going.

 

[clairejen]

I didn't mean to suggest you take your son to the doctor, I meant ring them and ask about it - just to put your mind at rest.

 

[KD]

I didn't mean to suggest you take your son to the doctor, I meant ring them and ask about it - just to put your mind at rest.

Ahhhh. Roiyt you rrrr (as they say in Dorset). He's seems to have recovered quickly and is back jumping buildings (Parkour fanatic)

Will ring doctor if it happens again. Though it was very short lived, it was scary to see him in so much pain.

 

[Isis]

KD, I'm glad to read that DS is recovered.

I can also totally relate to that feeling of concern that builds when they are unwell and then builds a bit more... and then you start to think.."is this a GP job?"...is this an A&E job?"....

It never ceases to amaze me how kids bounce back so quickly sometimes. The last time I had something similar was with my 9 year old DD...she felt like a furnace, headache, nausea etc etc.

She cried like a baby and climbed into my bed. I then went and brought a bucket and towel and laid it on the floor incase she was going to vomit, put the fan on, placed cold flannel on her head and then sat propped up all night next to her watching and waiting and wondering if it was something serious. She slept....all night. Woke at 6.30am and her first words were..."morning mummy, "did you have a good sleep?...I feel better now!!".

I resembled a washed out old hag that required matchsticks to keep my eyelids open!!!...but hey...my DD was well so all was ok