wafflewaffle
Gold Member
I've put 2lbs on since wed as well Urgh 
x
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newbie facing many challenges
- Thread starter caz78
- Start date
Grumpy Space Princess
oh my glob
Oh no, how frustrating.
I absolutely know where you're coming from with your worries about the nurse thinking you're just lazy. It's so hard to get past thoughts like that, but if she is at all good at her job, she will do what she can to help you with no judgement.
No one knows your body better than you. If you feel like you need to see your doctor because you're struggling, then go see your doctor. It's what they're there for.
The time you've spent hasn't been wasted. You have been building better habits. If you need to switch medication to make those habits have the effect they should, then at least you already have the foundations set for your future weight loss. A lot of people don't make it past the first week or even the first day when it comes to changing their habits. It is an accomplishment whether or not the scales reflect that.
Wishing you all the luck. xx
I absolutely know where you're coming from with your worries about the nurse thinking you're just lazy. It's so hard to get past thoughts like that, but if she is at all good at her job, she will do what she can to help you with no judgement.
No one knows your body better than you. If you feel like you need to see your doctor because you're struggling, then go see your doctor. It's what they're there for.
The time you've spent hasn't been wasted. You have been building better habits. If you need to switch medication to make those habits have the effect they should, then at least you already have the foundations set for your future weight loss. A lot of people don't make it past the first week or even the first day when it comes to changing their habits. It is an accomplishment whether or not the scales reflect that.
Wishing you all the luck. xx
Grumpy Space Princess
oh my glob
Oh, it's definitely not fair! I think your scales deserve to be chucked out of a high window for not reflecting your hard work.
TracyGWill
Gold Member
Oh hon, I know how frustrating that must be! Normally I'd say it must be down to the constipation, water retention due to exercise, and and other normal fluctuations, but I don't know what effect your medications could be having. So I would say definitely go and see your doctor. Tell them everything you've told us, about how hard you've been working for little reward, and discuss whether going back on Metformin may help. I'm sure there'll be an answer to it, you just need specialist advice. Most importantly, don't give up! xx
Normally I'd say it must be down to the constipation, water retention due to exercise, and and other normal fluctuations, but I don't know what effect your medications could be having. So I would say definitely go and see your doctor. Tell them everything you've told us, about how hard you've been working for little reward, and discuss whether going back on Metformin may help. I'm sure there'll be an answer to it, you just need specialist advice. Most importantly, don't give up! xx
caz78
Full Member
Thanks everyone.
I've had a little cry, had a long think, a chat with H and come up with a plan... God, I hope it works.
We have discussed before that I might need to add some more fat to my diet. Weeeelll, I have to be honest and admit I didn't do it. I was just too scared to take in the extra calories. I'm so determined to do this that I am realising I may have taken it too far. I have almost no fat in what I'm eating. Very very low fat, as little as 20g some days and as low as 1500 calories. I think I should be taking in at least 1700.
I was just too scared to increase my intake but I guess I have nothing to lose by trying seeing as I'm not losing weight. I also have to confess here that I had an eating disorder as a child. It didn't last long but I was basically almost anorectic. I became scared of food and stopped eating. Then, as you know, in later life I turned to binging. Sooooo, I have a really all or nothing take on food. I have been eating but it's all non fat stuff where possible.
I have a feeling I'm not eating enough fat, or food, to poop. I have a feeling my body is hanging on to everything, food, water, weight, cos I've dramatically changed everything so fast.
So, I asked myself (an old therapy trick) what would I say to a friend having the same problems? Then I ran it past hubby.
I've decided to increase my fat a bit (and I will really do it this time) to give the orlistat something to work on. I'm going to increase my food intake to my BMR amount. 1700 calories - although I am terrified that will be too much. I'm going to increase my water intake and use benefibre.
I'll do that for a week and see if it eases the water retention and constipation. Then when I see the nurse I can tell her I've tried everything. If it doesn't work, I'll see the doc then. Also it will get my period out of the way in case that's the problem.
I think there is a good chance I'm just not taking in enough fat to grease the wheels so to speak. I had this lovely idea that if I stopped eating fat as much as possible then the orlistat would take me to extremely low fat levels and my body would attack my fat stores. That doesn't seem to be the case. It seems to be scrabbling to hold onto it instead!
I'm a nightmare, I know. If that doesn't work then it can only be my meds causing the problem and I will see the dr.
I just have a gut feeling she is going to tell me I'm not eating enough fat if I see her straight away. Leaving it a week won't hurt, frustrating as it is.
What do you all think? Does that sound like a good plan or am I just messing myself around too much and trying pointless things?
Why can't it be as simple as, eat less fat - burn the fat on your body, the more you reduce your cals the quicker you lose, no starvation made, no water retention, no hormone problems, no meds causing weight problems? Wouldn't it be blissful if it was that simple. If our bodies observed the 'rules' of dieting. It used to be, I wish I had tackled my weight sooner, before I had all these problems.
Caz x
I've had a little cry, had a long think, a chat with H and come up with a plan... God, I hope it works.
We have discussed before that I might need to add some more fat to my diet. Weeeelll, I have to be honest and admit I didn't do it. I was just too scared to take in the extra calories. I'm so determined to do this that I am realising I may have taken it too far. I have almost no fat in what I'm eating. Very very low fat, as little as 20g some days and as low as 1500 calories. I think I should be taking in at least 1700.
I was just too scared to increase my intake but I guess I have nothing to lose by trying seeing as I'm not losing weight. I also have to confess here that I had an eating disorder as a child. It didn't last long but I was basically almost anorectic. I became scared of food and stopped eating. Then, as you know, in later life I turned to binging. Sooooo, I have a really all or nothing take on food. I have been eating but it's all non fat stuff where possible.
I have a feeling I'm not eating enough fat, or food, to poop. I have a feeling my body is hanging on to everything, food, water, weight, cos I've dramatically changed everything so fast.
So, I asked myself (an old therapy trick) what would I say to a friend having the same problems? Then I ran it past hubby.
I've decided to increase my fat a bit (and I will really do it this time) to give the orlistat something to work on. I'm going to increase my food intake to my BMR amount. 1700 calories - although I am terrified that will be too much. I'm going to increase my water intake and use benefibre.
I'll do that for a week and see if it eases the water retention and constipation. Then when I see the nurse I can tell her I've tried everything. If it doesn't work, I'll see the doc then. Also it will get my period out of the way in case that's the problem.
I think there is a good chance I'm just not taking in enough fat to grease the wheels so to speak. I had this lovely idea that if I stopped eating fat as much as possible then the orlistat would take me to extremely low fat levels and my body would attack my fat stores. That doesn't seem to be the case. It seems to be scrabbling to hold onto it instead!
I'm a nightmare, I know. If that doesn't work then it can only be my meds causing the problem and I will see the dr.
I just have a gut feeling she is going to tell me I'm not eating enough fat if I see her straight away. Leaving it a week won't hurt, frustrating as it is.
What do you all think? Does that sound like a good plan or am I just messing myself around too much and trying pointless things?
Why can't it be as simple as, eat less fat - burn the fat on your body, the more you reduce your cals the quicker you lose, no starvation made, no water retention, no hormone problems, no meds causing weight problems? Wouldn't it be blissful if it was that simple. If our bodies observed the 'rules' of dieting. It used to be, I wish I had tackled my weight sooner, before I had all these problems.
Caz x
caz78
Full Member
But then I'm really confused???? I you need so much fat and so much food to lose, how do people on vlcd's lose so much so fast?
I don't get it AT all!
I think I need to see my doc regardless but I may as well wait the month as I stand a better chance of getting the metformin if I don't go back too soon. She will probably say I haven't given it enough time.
I don't know why I'm finding this so difficult. I'm trying to do the right things but it's just not happening. I keep running round in circles. Too many cals? Not enough? Too much fat? Not enough? Am I exercising hard enough? drinking enough? getting enough fibre?
Frankly it's doing my head in!! It seems I don't know how to do this anymore. It used to be simple, half starve myself and the weight would fly off - but then of course I fell off the wagon, went to the other extreme and gain it all back plus some. But at least I could lose it then.
Caz x
I don't get it AT all!
I think I need to see my doc regardless but I may as well wait the month as I stand a better chance of getting the metformin if I don't go back too soon. She will probably say I haven't given it enough time.
I don't know why I'm finding this so difficult. I'm trying to do the right things but it's just not happening. I keep running round in circles. Too many cals? Not enough? Too much fat? Not enough? Am I exercising hard enough? drinking enough? getting enough fibre?
Frankly it's doing my head in!! It seems I don't know how to do this anymore. It used to be simple, half starve myself and the weight would fly off - but then of course I fell off the wagon, went to the other extreme and gain it all back plus some. But at least I could lose it then.
Caz x
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Grumpy Space Princess
oh my glob
That sounds like a good plan to me. Everyone is different, so people lose weight in different ways. What works for others might not work for you. I find it a lot easier to focus on finding the right path for me and not think too much about what others are doing. Easier said than done, I know! And it's always easier to offer advice to others vs taking your own advice.
I wonder... maybe it would help you to try to incorporate healthy fats since you are so afraid of fat? Stuff like oily fish, nuts, and avocados, if you like/are not allergic to any of those things. Fish and nuts have omega 3s, which are good for your brain, so instead of thinking, "Oh no, this is so fatty, it has so many calories, etc," you can try reminding yourself that by eating it you are doing a good thing for your brain's health. And nuts and avocados, especially, have fibre which may help with the constipation.
Everyone is different, so people lose weight in different ways. What works for others might not work for you. I find it a lot easier to focus on finding the right path for me and not think too much about what others are doing. Easier said than done, I know! And it's always easier to offer advice to others vs taking your own advice.I wonder... maybe it would help you to try to incorporate healthy fats since you are so afraid of fat? Stuff like oily fish, nuts, and avocados, if you like/are not allergic to any of those things. Fish and nuts have omega 3s, which are good for your brain, so instead of thinking, "Oh no, this is so fatty, it has so many calories, etc," you can try reminding yourself that by eating it you are doing a good thing for your brain's health. And nuts and avocados, especially, have fibre which may help with the constipation.
TracyGWill
Gold Member
I would definitely say go with your plan of upping your calorie and fat levels. As you say, it can't hurt, and you'll be able to tell the nurse the steps you've taken. You shouldn't really try to compare VLCDs with a normal low calorie diet, as they're totally different in the way they work, with the body going into ketosis etc. As I said before, there WILL be a solution, and you will find it! xx
You shouldn't really try to compare VLCDs with a normal low calorie diet, as they're totally different in the way they work, with the body going into ketosis etc. As I said before, there WILL be a solution, and you will find it! xx
caz78
Full Member
I really wish there was some way I could thank you all properly. You're such an amazing bunch on here, so patient and so helpful, most people would have rolled their eyes at me and given up by now!:thankyou:
I was laying in bed last night fantasizing about peanut butter on toast, I've read that sometimes you crave precisely what you're body needs so for a day or two I am going to relax a lot even if it's just to get things moving. So I am going to replace my low fat snack with that bit of peanut butter today and also add a smidge of real butter to my main meal. This won't be the norm, it's just to try and give my body what I think it needs. If I can get the orlistat to do something then that may help me get going again. Laxatives aren't working.
I love nuts and fish so that's definitely a good way to go, thank you!
Thanks Tracy for explaining how vlcd's work. I get it now! I think that's why I lost weight so easily on diets before. I bet I went so low that the same thing happened. I would live off veg soup and Weetabix. So, I'm guessing vlcd's work because of the ketosis and eating so low your body has no choice but to eat it's own fat, around a 1000-1200 cal diets work at first cos it's a dramatic change but then your body starts to hold onto stuff so weight loss slows or stops and a more relaxed diet allows you to lose at a lower rate but more consistently. I've tried the first two options so now it's time to try the last one.
Healthy balanced eating may be the way. who'd of thunk it! I know my pills goose my metabolism but I also know the best way to boost that is to eat enough and exercise a lot so that's what I am going to do, scary as it is. I've got nothing to lose.
You guys have been far more help than my lovely doc!
She's great but pretty clueless about all my meds, she didn't even know how much fat I should eat on orlistat and when I mentioned metformin for insulin resistance from PCOS she looked blank. Bless em, GP's do their best but when you get a messy patient like me it can't be easy lol. I've got so many specific health problems they usually ask me what the treatment is lol.
I'd have probably cracked and gone back to binging by now if it hadn't been for you lovely people keeping me going, reading my ramblings and really putting your heads together to help.
Caz x
I was laying in bed last night fantasizing about peanut butter on toast, I've read that sometimes you crave precisely what you're body needs so for a day or two I am going to relax a lot even if it's just to get things moving. So I am going to replace my low fat snack with that bit of peanut butter today and also add a smidge of real butter to my main meal. This won't be the norm, it's just to try and give my body what I think it needs. If I can get the orlistat to do something then that may help me get going again. Laxatives aren't working.
I love nuts and fish so that's definitely a good way to go, thank you!
Thanks Tracy for explaining how vlcd's work. I get it now! I think that's why I lost weight so easily on diets before. I bet I went so low that the same thing happened. I would live off veg soup and Weetabix. So, I'm guessing vlcd's work because of the ketosis and eating so low your body has no choice but to eat it's own fat, around a 1000-1200 cal diets work at first cos it's a dramatic change but then your body starts to hold onto stuff so weight loss slows or stops and a more relaxed diet allows you to lose at a lower rate but more consistently. I've tried the first two options so now it's time to try the last one.
Healthy balanced eating may be the way. who'd of thunk it! I know my pills goose my metabolism but I also know the best way to boost that is to eat enough and exercise a lot so that's what I am going to do, scary as it is. I've got nothing to lose.
You guys have been far more help than my lovely doc!
She's great but pretty clueless about all my meds, she didn't even know how much fat I should eat on orlistat and when I mentioned metformin for insulin resistance from PCOS she looked blank. Bless em, GP's do their best but when you get a messy patient like me it can't be easy lol. I've got so many specific health problems they usually ask me what the treatment is lol.
I'd have probably cracked and gone back to binging by now if it hadn't been for you lovely people keeping me going, reading my ramblings and really putting your heads together to help.
Caz x
Winterjasmine
Persistent dieter
Hi Caz
It's all such a minefield, isn't it? But as Tracy and Grumpy SP said, different diets work because they work in different ways. I know I've driven myself almost nuts in the past trying to work out the common threads. There's a school of thought out there that says it's all about carbs - that even if all you do is reduce calories, you'll be eating fewer carbs as a result. There's another school of thought out there that says it's all about sugar. Another school of thought says it's all about fructose. Still another that it's all about fibre. Another that it's all about fat. Another that says it's about wheat and the fact that the wheat we now eat bears little to no resemblance to the wheat our great grandparents eat...
Honestly, it could be about all of those things, some of them or none of them. And the only thing that'll work for you is, quite simply, the plan that works for you. Not the plan that works for your Mum's best friend, the plan that works for your cousin or even the plan that worked for *you* ten years ago. It needs to be something that works for you now. That's why you'll see success stories for every weight loss method under the sun. But that's also why you'll see "that didn't work for me" stories for every diet under the sun. The diet that'll work for you long term is the diet that you can stick to for the long term.
Reading between the lines here, I think you need a plan that includes foods you'd like to eat. There's absolutely nothing wrong with peanut butter on toast. And you may need to experiment a bit with calories. Yes, you may appear to lose weight more quickly sticking to 1,200 calories a day, but if you crash and burn after 6 days of semi-starvation and go on a week long feeding frenzy (Yep - got that t-shirt!) then 1,200 calories a day isn't going to work. 1,700 calories a day may feel like it's gonna take longer, but if you don't crash off the plan so often, it'll actually get you there faster (a lesson I'm determined to learn this time!).
For what it's worth, I think you're on the verge of cracking this dieting malarkey, once and for all.
It's all such a minefield, isn't it? But as Tracy and Grumpy SP said, different diets work because they work in different ways. I know I've driven myself almost nuts in the past trying to work out the common threads. There's a school of thought out there that says it's all about carbs - that even if all you do is reduce calories, you'll be eating fewer carbs as a result. There's another school of thought out there that says it's all about sugar. Another school of thought says it's all about fructose. Still another that it's all about fibre. Another that it's all about fat. Another that says it's about wheat and the fact that the wheat we now eat bears little to no resemblance to the wheat our great grandparents eat...
Honestly, it could be about all of those things, some of them or none of them. And the only thing that'll work for you is, quite simply, the plan that works for you. Not the plan that works for your Mum's best friend, the plan that works for your cousin or even the plan that worked for *you* ten years ago. It needs to be something that works for you now. That's why you'll see success stories for every weight loss method under the sun. But that's also why you'll see "that didn't work for me" stories for every diet under the sun. The diet that'll work for you long term is the diet that you can stick to for the long term.
Reading between the lines here, I think you need a plan that includes foods you'd like to eat. There's absolutely nothing wrong with peanut butter on toast. And you may need to experiment a bit with calories. Yes, you may appear to lose weight more quickly sticking to 1,200 calories a day, but if you crash and burn after 6 days of semi-starvation and go on a week long feeding frenzy (Yep - got that t-shirt!) then 1,200 calories a day isn't going to work. 1,700 calories a day may feel like it's gonna take longer, but if you don't crash off the plan so often, it'll actually get you there faster (a lesson I'm determined to learn this time!).
For what it's worth, I think you're on the verge of cracking this dieting malarkey, once and for all.
TracyGWill
Gold Member
Really good advice there from Winterjasmine - yeah, what she said!! xx
xx
caz78
Full Member
Thank you so much! That's really helpful and very encouraging. I totally get what you're saying, it's trial and error, having the patience to find what works and sticking with trying until you do. Not being too strict but still being careful.
I really hope I'm getting there.
I can't thank you enough.
Caz x
:gen126:
I really hope I'm getting there.
I can't thank you enough.
Caz x
:gen126:
caz78
Full Member
DO NOT READ ON IF YOU'RE EATING, DRINKING OR SQUEAMISH! Orlistat works lol.
Wow, am I ever embarrassed to be sharing this
Damn, can't have my peanut butter now lol.
Sorry, this is going to be MAJOR tmi, but the Eagle has landed lol. My God what a relief!
I have been bunged up since taking Orlistat and only 'been' a few times. I've been taking laxatives to no effect etc etc
So, as I said I allowed myself some fat at lunch. More than I plan to use in future as I had the intent of getting things moving. I put a tiny bit of butter on my poached egg on toast instead of flora light. 1 hr later and I'm sorted! I really didn't expect it to work so fast or on so little fat! I saw my first orange too so I know it was down to the little bit of extra fat and the orlistsat. No bad effect just the colour on the paper (sorry). I had the butter cos I wasn't sure if the peanut butter later would be enough. Shouldn't have worried, the little bit of fat was plenty lol.
My system works quickly when I have fat apparently! I didn't think it would have an effect til tomorrow. I'm not complaining lol.
I'll save the peanut butter til next time I need a nudge.
Clearly I do need the slight increase in fat, just not that much unless it's an emergency! lol.
So if I make the changes I planned to, semi instead of skimmed milk, normal cottage cheese instead of fat free - then I should be ok. I hope it will be enough to keep my system moving but not so much I will get side effects. But if constipation is a problem again, well I know what to do lol.
It's really bizarre how just a spoonful of butter can tip the balance so much! If that small amount can take me from totally bunged up to a huge relief then I can't see how some people, like my sister can eat crisps, chips, pizza, garlic bread etc! its definitely a case of eating healthily and allowing 'just' enough fat cos it could so easily turn into disaster!
So sorry this is such a gross post but I sure feel better!
I guess there is such a thing as being 'too' good.
Caz x
Wow, am I ever embarrassed to be sharing this Damn, can't have my peanut butter now lol.
Sorry, this is going to be MAJOR tmi, but the Eagle has landed lol. My God what a relief!
I have been bunged up since taking Orlistat and only 'been' a few times. I've been taking laxatives to no effect etc etc
So, as I said I allowed myself some fat at lunch. More than I plan to use in future as I had the intent of getting things moving. I put a tiny bit of butter on my poached egg on toast instead of flora light. 1 hr later and I'm sorted! I really didn't expect it to work so fast or on so little fat! I saw my first orange too so I know it was down to the little bit of extra fat and the orlistsat. No bad effect just the colour on the paper (sorry). I had the butter cos I wasn't sure if the peanut butter later would be enough. Shouldn't have worried, the little bit of fat was plenty lol.
My system works quickly when I have fat apparently! I didn't think it would have an effect til tomorrow. I'm not complaining lol.
I'll save the peanut butter til next time I need a nudge.
Clearly I do need the slight increase in fat, just not that much unless it's an emergency! lol.
So if I make the changes I planned to, semi instead of skimmed milk, normal cottage cheese instead of fat free - then I should be ok. I hope it will be enough to keep my system moving but not so much I will get side effects. But if constipation is a problem again, well I know what to do lol.
It's really bizarre how just a spoonful of butter can tip the balance so much! If that small amount can take me from totally bunged up to a huge relief then I can't see how some people, like my sister can eat crisps, chips, pizza, garlic bread etc! its definitely a case of eating healthily and allowing 'just' enough fat cos it could so easily turn into disaster!
So sorry this is such a gross post but I sure feel better!
I guess there is such a thing as being 'too' good.
Caz x
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Grumpy Space Princess
oh my glob
LOL! Well, now you know!
And we absolutely wouldn't roll our eyes and give up on you; I'm pretty sure we've all been in a similar situation, when it seems like nothing is working and we're putting effort in for nothing! :hug99:
And we absolutely wouldn't roll our eyes and give up on you; I'm pretty sure we've all been in a similar situation, when it seems like nothing is working and we're putting effort in for nothing! :hug99:
caz78
Full Member
You're all superstars! :bighug::flowers:
Now I just need to hope the scales will start moving soon. For now though I'm just happy I am lol!
I'm not giving up, even if they don't. There will be a way for me to lose weight and I will find it. Makes sense to try everything in moderation and a healthy system before I try anything else though.
Caz x
Now I just need to hope the scales will start moving soon. For now though I'm just happy I am lol!
I'm not giving up, even if they don't. There will be a way for me to lose weight and I will find it. Makes sense to try everything in moderation and a healthy system before I try anything else though.
Caz x
TracyGWill
Gold Member
Lol, as a former Orlistat user I can definitely relate to that, although it definitely took a lot more fat to have that effect on me - it must be because you've been eating so little fat. xx
xx
caz78
Full Member
Lol! Maybe it was the egg too, they're quite high in fat. I was being so careful before I was only using a small egg, today I had a large one. I can be a bit iffy with eggs, they have set me off even before orlistat but that was usually if i ate two!
It's just finding the balance now and I think just small changes, like my milk, should put me about right. The rest I will steer clear of. In case of emergency only lol.
Caz x
It's just finding the balance now and I think just small changes, like my milk, should put me about right. The rest I will steer clear of. In case of emergency only lol.
Caz x
wafflewaffle
Gold Member
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